Unbelievable!!!

I have just been browsing a few news sites and found this article regarding MBD and Frans Basson. Never before have I seen such unresearched and reckless journalism...

http://free.financialmail.co.za/innovations/0905/binn.htm

Unbelievable!

To review one or two of the statements made in the article:

1. 'MBD has turned debt collecting into a science with a powerful combination of innovative technology, psychology and processes. '

The only 'psychology and processes' that I have seen in action are those of intimidation and harassment - bullying consumers into paying off debts that are often non existent...
The process is also designed in such a way as to make meaningful communication and access to statements virtually impossible.
Has anybody out there ever received a statement declaring that a debt has been settled after making payment? I have yet to receive such feedback. I only get reports of settled debts getting reactivated with extra interest and fees added...
Has anybody (of the select few who have managed to wrest a statement or two from Cerberus) ever received two statements that do not conflict!? I doubt that too...

2. 'Breaking more kneecaps than the next guy is not the way MBD got ahead. Nor was it by threatening debt defaulters with legal action. Indeed, over 90% of the company's collections are received through amicable negotiations, against an industry standard of 26%. '

No threats of legal action!? Please, don't make me laugh... That is ALL they do!!! I have countless copies of emails and sms's stating the direct opposite. Too bad they are a bit slack when it comes to actually engaging in direct legal action...

Have any of you ever had an amicable conversation with MBD call centre staff member!? Please let me know - it will be a first...

There are a lot of ways to 'break kneecaps' without resorting to violence. What would damaging a person's credit reputation because of a proscribed or non-existent debt be called? The effect is more crippling than any broken kneecap...

MBD also knows very well that they cannot afford to take these matters to court as the truth has a way of coming out during court hearings. Why do you think I have been demanding a court subpoena for 7 years with no result!? I have also yet to receive an email from somebody that has actually seen the mighty MBD generate a subpoena. I do, on the other hand, have quite a few letters from readers who have been unable to get one, like me...

3. His bags were packed, his house was sold and he had cash in the bank. Debt collections specialist Frans Basson had a ticket to the world and he was determined to enjoy the ride.

(What a pity he didn't use his ticket... It's never too late to leave Mr Basson! I hear the weather is great in North Eastern Siberia...)

I can only assume that the facts were not as easy to find by using a simple Google search at the time of publication....

Please Ms Planting - check your facts before going to print! Your readers expect more from you.

Some good advice

My sorry association with MBD statred in beginning 2002. I had a business(CC) that liquidated in May 2001 after enormous medical bills with my childs birth in 2000. I had a MTN contract that was part of the liquidation, but about a year later MBD contacted me and stated that I signed surety in my private capacity and are due roughly R2000 principal debt (cancellation costs of contract and telephony costs). By the time they contacted me, legal fees, interest fees, administration costs ampounted to R6000+. At this stage I was frantic that a bad credit record would not spill over from the CC to my private name and I started paying R500 a month.(To all who is reading this - it is all an illusion, the whole debt collect system feeds on fear, get to know your rights) At first I could not understand why they had to contact me so often, via phone calls, letters and the infamous SMS's. The explanation would always be that it is from"another department"

At one stage I had confusing SMS's confirming re-payment schedules of R250, R500, R1000 per month all at different times of the month! For years I believed them just to be the most incompetent and rude bunch of people imanigable, but soon started suspecting that this was a manufactured strategy to run up costs. In April 2004 after paying for 2 years (I have to admit not every month) my outstanding balance was way over R10 000!

I started diarising their call history and SMS history for a while in 2005 and 2006. After several attempts/requests to get them to stop harassing me (up tp 9 contacts in 1 day!!!), or take me to court so that we can settle this, there was still no improvement and they kept on ignoring my requests to stop the SMS's. I started suspecting that these guys were running a scam. I spoke to an attorney who adviced me that I must get a copy of any credit agreement that I had with them - I also started asking for a detailed list of their fees as well as a break down of interest charges and the rate of interest charged - After several (billed) phonecalls all I got was those...4 line opening balance, paid, now outstanding pieces of paper. I stopped all repayments in 2007 every time that they phoned I refused to pay before I get a copy of where I signed for interest charges of 24% and a detailed breakdown of liability, interest, charges and fees for my attorney to take it further..they kept on saying that my attorney must get it..then I would explain that I have the right to ask for it...they would promise to get it posted to me...never to hear from them again. Case closed, right? Huh uh. Started phoning me again last month after a long silence. 3 times in one month I had to explain what I want from them - not a balance enquiry - A freaking detailed account history from start to date!

Today 8 May 2008 I spoke to Mbali and her supervisor Jafta - after insults like "why have you not paid your account since 17 - 5 - 2002?" (good God man I must have paid way more than R10 000 - R15 000 to them!) and Jafta saying he will e-mail my history now ("are you sitting in front of your system? I am sending it now") I have not received a thing. I phoned 011 560 4679 explained my whole story (again!!!), demanding a detailed history of the account, where after I received a call from Mbali again stating that although I owe more than R4000 they will settle the account for R2000. I declined and said that I want the detailed history record of the account. I phoned this number again and said that I want that record before the end of business today otherwise I will go to the Law Society, WASPA and every Debt Collectors body that I can think of - she put the phone down in my ear! (And I do hope that that call was recorded so that my tone of speech will be open for all to hear)

That was when I hit internet to look at my rights and found your blog. These people are for sure contravening the National Credit Act 34 of 2005, the Ursury Act of 1968 and the normally accepted guidelines of their profession

They harass people with calls, SMS's and threats, they pretend that litigation has already taken place etc.

Refuse to give consumers information regarding their accounts or proper statements of account, which they may legally not do.

The in duplum rule states that the interest levied on principal debt may not exceed the value of the principal debt, after June 2007 the amount of interest and charges after the consumer defaults may not be more than the capital owing at the time of the default. (They will clearly loose more than half of their 'book' if all their victims know this.)

Debt collectors can charge for necessarry letters, faxes or e-mails (how necessary is 6 SMS's per day after 3 calls, just to remind you of your agreement of 10 minutes ago when that agreement has been standing for longer than a year and you are paying every month? - or thanking you for your payment via SMS and then charging you more than R12 for the thank you SMS? Just to phone you tonight to confirm the settlement again?(Another R12+)

Over the 7 years they have often drawn up a settlement account and send it to me (of course charging me for it) - they may only do this at the request of the debtor.

For longer than 3 years I have tried to get them to give me a statement indicating the interest rate. No success there either. I suspect strongly that they have acted outside the law regarding the Ursury Act's interest rate cap.

Collection Cost may not exceed the cost incurred in collecting the debt - within guidelines set by Law Society and Debt Collectors Act.....now if I can just get my detailed statement......

During 2006 MBD started contacting me on another reference number for bad debt from Nashua - this was for a photo copy machine that was part of the liquidated business from 2001 - They used strong arm tactics to get me to pay. There was one exception - because this old huge photo copy machine only fetched R400 at the auction I remembered that it was absolutely settled as part of the CC's liquidation. I told them to get lost and that the debt had prescribed in any way. They still tried a couple of times, telling me to get police affadavits, curator reports etc before it went quiet on that score.

I see on internet that JM attorneys are affiliated with MBD - just to let you know, same procedure with JM attorneys and a Telkom account from 2000 that was also part of the liquidation in 2001. These are unscrupulous greedy characters that have to be stopped. I can not contribute money to your cause, but will gladly testify as part of a drive to get these guys sorted out. They have infringed upon my rights and it is time to fight back!

Nomorembd

Keep up the good work!

Fedup

PS If there is a sharp final year law student or two reading this, why not start an action whereby a reversal of all in duplum 'overcharges' are paid back to all victims and you take a 20% fee from those who sign up? And make name for yourself...and help clean up your profession...

(Thanks for this letter, Fedup, it will definitely help to clear up some questions. Regarding the lawayer - you will be glad to know that I have contracted the services of a young, sharp law firm who are out to make a name for themselves - tackling and defeating a fat firm like MBD is exactly the case they were looking for!) - MBD Victim

Introduction

Fed up with MBD Attorney's constant harassment at your cost? Finding it hard to get any feedback from them? Are you constantly frustrated with the arrogant behaviour of their so called 'consultants?' Are you still waiting for a breakdown of the 'legal fees' that are charged, or even an indication of the interest rate charged?

If you said yes to any of these questions above, or any such related issues - you have come to the right place. For those not acquainted with MBD Attorneys - here is a quick update:

MBD Attorneys is a law firm that seemingly specialises in debt collecting. They also buy debtors books from large corporate companies and then follow up on the outstanding debts on their own behalf. Kind of reminds one of a certain species of large bird, doesn't it? Picking over the leftover bones of other, more able hunters...

It seems that MBD Attorneys have no real interest in actually recovering the outstanding debts. Instead they let it simmer a while to gain interest (at an undeclared interest rate) before initiating step two, the harassment. After a first call out of the blue (remember these are usually old debts that have been disputed by the client) the fun starts. Regardless of your level of cooperation you will receive calls and sms's on a constant basis - office hours, after hours, weekends (right after or during Saturday afternoon Rugby is a favourite) any time reminding you of the payment due, or else they will 'proceed with legal action.' What they conveniently forget to tell you is that you get billed for each and every sms or phone call made, regardless if you pay the agreed monthly installment or not. Again, it is not for us mere mortals to know how much we are being charged as the 'consultants' are 'unable to send detailed accounts'

The best you will get looks something like this:
Initial amount owed: R1100-00
Interest on amount: R1100-00
Legal Fees: R5700-00
Payments: R4000-00
Total outstanding: R3900-00

Any attempt to get more specified info will most certainly result in failure, coupled with more phone calls and sms's of a threatening nature.

From where I stand it looks like they are 'farming' with old debt - I shall call it Debt Farming. A lot of the debtors are already in this position because they cannot afford to pay the debts due to some or other financial challenge. By increasing the debt amount drastically, MBD actually ensures that this debtor will never, or with great difficulty be able to repay the debt. The can often afford a monthly payment, to keep their name clean. Good one for MBD - they now have thousands slaves for life...

Is this how one practices law? I wonder when is the last time they handled a real legal case - being the great law firm an' all?

Evidence of this is the fact that no one ever seems to receive (as far as I have been able to detect) a subpoena or any other direct action to actually recover the debt. In my case I have been waiting 7 (yes, seven) years for my day in court to fight this, but how do you fight a predator that stays in hiding? I can only deduce from this that it is actually in MBD's interest to raise the amount owed, instead of really trying to recover the original outstanding debt. Who will want to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs if you can keep it alive for ever?

I am also one of the victims of this unscrupulous company with it's rapacious attitude and systems and have decided to strike back at them. After all, we are still consumers and what these guys are doing is unacceptable. I call on everyone with an MBD story to tell, to share it with us here. Just mail it, and I will publish it (names and contact details will be treated as confidential.)

The data that we receive will help us to deliver a comprehensive report regarding this company to the SA Legal Council, SA Debt Collectors Association, Carte Blanche and all journalists or other interested parties that we are able to contact.

MBD No More!!!

PS. (To get a good idea of how widespread this problem is, visit Hello Peter and search 'mbd attorneys' - you'll be terrified by the tales of woe to be read there...)

And the story goes on and on...

Well, I am sure that the story of absolute harassment from these people has been told many times.

I am absolutely appalled at Frans Basson's attitude toward trampling on peoples rights, he actually makes fun of it and justifies the complaints by saying that it comes with the territory to upset people from whom you are collecting debt and its just about learning to stay ahead of the knives. I am trying to get hold of his personal details so that when they send me an sms in the middle of the night that I can get in my car and go to his house and answer in person, I will do it every single night if I have to.

These people have made me so angry that I will stop at nothing in my quest to show them that I am not a helpless victim if that means spending thousands of rand then so be it, its the principal of the whole thing. (I'm 100% behind you on that one! - MBD Victim)

My story begins in late 2005 when these people first made contact with me and informed me that they were collecting for Foschini and that there was an eight year old debt. Naturally I was astonished and wanted more detail. Later they told me it was a Sterns account and then a Foschini account again.

The amount was a small one, somewhere around R1100.00, after MBD added all their charges the debt grew to R2400.00.

I have requested telephonically and eventually in writing that they furnish me detail of this so-called account, all they do is send me a statement from MBD attorneys.

In the meantime I receive threatening phone calls daily from people barely literate enough to put together coherent sentences.

After initially being patient and explaining my plight, I eventually just got to the point of hanging up the phone the moment they call.

I have people telling me:
-That I will be blacklisted
-I have no right to ask for detail of this account I must just pay it
-If the account is not mine then why do they know my ID number
-Not paying my accounts is a criminal offence
-That MBD is not Sterns, how can I expect them to supply me proof of purchase
And so much more!

I have been collecting a library of hundreds of sms's threatening legal action and I am thinking about contacting Vodacom to get a printout of all the calls made to me to prove the extent of harassment.

These people pride themselves on collecting R1 billion pa whilst their closest opposition only collects R300 million, those of us that have experienced MBD’s ruthless unethical behaviour know that they collect more because they totally trample peoples rights.

Frans Basson, please understand that the wheel turns and if we ever have the opportunity to unleash a world of aggravation on you, its coming with interest!!!

(Name withheld)

PS (Congrats and well done on your efforts, I am willing to give time and money to this cause.)

Good news! Ex MBD employee responds

I have recently been contacted by somebody who used to work for MBD Attorneys and have now also landed in their clutches. This helps our cause a lot as she is willing to speak to our reporters and make a formal statement regarding the goings on at MBD.

Below is a copy of a letter recently sent to me by her:

Hi There

I have worked for MBD and have seen all the disgusting and illegal tactics they get up to. What MBD does is that they buy the credit books from companies and then try and collect on anything outstanding that they possibly can, while adding their own illegal fees. Some of them are not even credit books - take colleges like Lyceum for instance. When a person goes there to inquire about studies, they fill in forms with their personal details. MBD buys those forms from them and after a few years start using intimidation to collect money from those people, even when they know that person didn't even study there.

When you look at the illegal fees the add, they don't make sense, they differ from one person to another, it's not about how much they owe and they are ridiculously high.

I think that once these companies have handed you over, they don't care what happens to you, just as long as they get their money. I have also been handed over to them by Virgin Active and from VA all I needed to do was settle my account with them which didn't include any interest and I could go back and start gym again, even though I hadn't paid MBD's money. Once I settled the account, including MBD's amount, I would work on my account while I sill worked there (at MBD), sending a query to their admin department, saying the debtor called and requests a letter of prove that the account has been paid. I must have sent it about four times and still received nothing.

What is more scary is that I noticed that all the accounts that have been settled are put into frozen status. I am not exactly sure, but I have a feeling that while they are on this status they still accumulate interest and after a few years, the account gets activated again, and the bullying starts again. That is the reason they will not give you a letter stating that the account is settled because it will be proof to stop them from harassing you. I have spoken to debtors who say they settled their accounts with MBD years before and don't understand why we are calling them again. These people are very greedy and they don't care whether yours was a case of mistaken identity that you can prove. They want their money no matter what. Almost all my friends have been or are still handed over to them and some of their stories are hilarious but very infuriating at the same time.

As for the consultants, they don't even know what is going on. They are just trained to collect money from debtors. Whether the company is operating within the legal structure, they have no clue. I remember seeing accounts of these consultants themselves and being scared to work on them because of how rude they tell other debtors. Some of these people are older than my mother, but when I tell people the disgusting things they say to debtors....

If you need assistance, don't hesitate to ask.

(Name and contact details withheld)